Adrienne

Transcript:

Joel

Hey, I'm Joel Alsup and this is “St. Jude Storied Lives.” This podcast is about getting a chance to know someone's life after they finish treatment at St. Jude Children's Research Hospital. I was a St. Jude patient too, and I can tell you there's so much more to me than my cancer story, even though it's something I carry with me every single day.

Today, I want you to meet Adrienne. She wears her St. Jude story right on her skin.

Adrienne

I recently got a tattoo of my St. Jude patient number on my arm. Yeah, my kids, they got a kick out of that, and they're like, Did it hurt? Did it hurt? I was like, Not at all. I'm kind of used to needles you know? So, I've had a ----lot of needles in my life, and this was pretty tame.

Joel

Adrienne's patient number isn't too big, and that's because she was treated at St. Jude a long time ago. They give us all numbers in order of when we came to the hospital starting in 1962. She was very young when she was treated here. So young, in fact, that she actually doesn't remember much of what brought her to St. Jude.

Her mom later told her that she had a lot of infections and bruises. And eventually she was diagnosed with ALL. That's acute lymphoblastic leukemia. But Adrienne does have some good memories of her early days here at St. Jude.

Adrienne

I just remember going to this cool place that had doctor stools that had wheels on them, and I could sit on them and roll around and spin around and go down hallways on them. And then I'd go and get my vitals checked and the nurse in there would give me beads and necklaces and stickers. And then the amazing cartoon mural that was on the lobby waiting room.

Joel

I remember those murals. I have vague memories of those murals.

Adrienne

Yes. I would just look at that. Oh, my gosh, Look, Winnie the Pooh and all that. But yeah, they were more positive. I didn't know any different. And I do have some not happy memories. But for the most part, it was a positive thing.

I see it now that I'm, you know, older and a mom myself. I see it more so from a parent perspective and wanting to shed the light on all the parents. Like, yes, we say the kids are the heroes. They're the ones going through all of that treatment and it's horrible and it feels bad, and it sucks. But the parents to me are almost the bigger heroes.

Joel

Oh, yeah. I mean, because especially for you, at that age, totally unsure of what you're going through, and your parent has to walk with you every step of the way.

Adrienne

Yes. They might as well be going through it as well, the treatment, because they're feeling all of the pain that their child is going through for sure. On top of life, they're paying bills and, you know, and that was a huge relief, obviously, to not have to worry about paying a bill to St. Jude. You know, they never received a bill, and everything obviously was taken care of, which was huge.

I was lucky enough to live here in Memphis and I was diagnosed in 1979, and my pediatrician knew obviously about St. Jude, and I was able to be there at a moment's notice.

You know, I recall coming to St. Jude pretty much up until I was about 15. Just off and on for checkups. So, it's always been a part of my life. I don't know any different.

Joel

I know the feeling. And from that active treatment standpoint too, so you started in 1979 with that diagnosis of leukemia. How long did that actual active treatment last before checkups started?

Adrienne

Up until ‘82. So, it's been 40 years. This is my 40th year of being cancer free or treatment free. They didn't have no more chemo parties back then.

I do remember, though, taking pills, like I remember you know, my mom giving me a bunch of medicine, like in the kitchen, you know, being at home and having to take all that and I remember we called them back sticks. They were the spinal taps.

Joel

Oh, gosh. I can't imagine how that had to feel for two, three year old to go through that.

Adrienne

Oh, man, that was bad. That was bad. I still to this day, I’m in my 40’s and I remember it very clearly. But, you know, growing up, my mom was always, both of my parents, were always very, you know, watchful of me, and any kind of ear infection or sickness, they were just like, What's wrong?

I even remember when I was three, I think, and I was going through treatment, and I fell in the bathtub and hit my chin on the bathtub and busted my chin open. And my parents didn't take me to the E.R. or any place else, they took me to St. Jude. And the St. Jude. doctor stitched up my chin. So, I mean, anything health related my parents were relying on St. Jude for everything.

Joel

Well, I gotta take you back to one thing because I'm impressed by something. I know if you're able to do this or not, but because I wasn’t. I was on treatment as a seven-year-old, I could not swallow the pills they gave me. Were you able to swallow it because I had to take them with a certain kind of candy, which I won't besmirch their name. I still can't eat that candy to this day because I had to chew my pills with this candy. So how did you do that? As a much younger person?

Adrienne

I don't know. I remember my parents giving me popcorn seeds to practice and of course, M&M's I think was one. But I don't know. I don't know how I did.

Joel

I'm just impressed because I struggled so bad. I can do it now. Finally, as a 42-year-old, I can swallow pills.

Adrienne

Right, right. Yeah, exactly. I wish I could give some tips to my son because he still can’t swallow a pill. He’s 13.

Joel

So like you said, you know, you grew up kind of aware of what was going on in the hospital on active treatment. But like you said, it stayed part of your life because you kept going back for checkups. What were some of the things that stick out in your mind about St. Jude as you did go back for those checkups and grow up here essentially?

Adrienne

It was always just a welcoming place, like I never dreaded coming. Just overall thinking back, it was never, I'm sure it was for my mom and my dad, but not for me. There were so many fun things as a kid that I didn't really focus on the bad things. You know, there was a gift shop, there was, you know, the mural and all the toys and there was a doll house that was really amazing that I loved.

But it was a good place to go. I don't think I have memories of it being like, you have to go here to get treatment to get better, because I didn't know I was that sick. I didn't understand the weight of that. And I don't know if any child that age does. I mean, you were seven, so it may have been a little bit more clear.

Joel

It was clear what I was going through. But it's kind of the same thing, like, okay, I'll just do this.

Adrienne

Yeah, yeah. It's like, I don't have a choice. I'm just going to do this. But looking back as an adult now and I'm just grateful that, you know, St. Jude just welcomed us and took my parents by the hand and said, We are going to guide you through all of this. We're here. You're not alone. And being surrounded by other families and kids who had similar diagnosis, you know, its own community, and it did take a village. But I'm grateful that St. Jude was there for my parents.

Joel

I completely understand. Just seeing, I'm like that now, too. I have, you know, two kids and you look at it from a totally different perspective of like, oh my gosh, like my parents were such heroes to handle this the way they did.

Adrienne

Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. My mom had had three miscarriages before me and then she finally got me. And then I end up, you know, having cancer. And then three years later, after I was born, my sister was born.

But growing up, some of the effects of the chemo were evident when I started school. I think by the time I got to the third grade, my grades were awful. I just did not understand math. Reading was difficult, and I remember crying in school. And then, you know, my sister, who was three years behind me, you know, was already reading and, you know, everything. So she was, you know, doing okay. And then I wasn’t. I know you're not supposed to compare your children, but still.

And then my parents, after having conversations with my school, they didn't have any input really. They didn't know how to help me other than maybe some resource classes and holding me back in school and stuff like that. So, my parents reached out to St. Jude and said, Look, what can we do? And St. Jude, you know, had told them that she may have some effects from some of the medication.

You know, St. Jude recommended a little special school here in Memphis, and my parents took me there, and so I went there for a year. And the next year I went back into the public school system after spending a year in the private school, and I went from making C’s D’ and F’s to A’s B’ and C’s in one year. So, it truly helped me, not overcome, but be able to push myself forward and deal with the side effects the best way I could and to make better grades.

And so finally, when I graduated from college, I graduated with honors. I made straight A's, and I was like, yes, I did it. And it was an amazing feeling because not only did I beat cancer, but like I beat some of the side effects, too, you know, on my own.

Joel

And I know too like even though it was a push for some of the things, one of the things that you always had passion for was art. How did art kind of play throughout, you know, not only just your normal life, but your school life and how you kind of communicated about what you were going through.

Adrienne

Art has probably been a part of my life since I was probably about third grade. When I started having issues in school, the only thing that I found that I was fairly good at was art, and I didn't care what people thought about it. There was no grade, and I just found a peace with it, and nothing bad was going to happen with art, you know, there were no shots, there were no bad grades.

There was nobody telling me, You got to do this. You got to do that. I can do anything with, you know, markers and a piece of paper. So, I did start really getting into art about that age, third grade or so. And any kind of anything with my hand. Art comes in many forms.

So, you know, I loved working with my hands. I loved getting dirty with them, making things with Play-Doh and making things with, you know, markers and paper and everything. And so, I entered little contests at school and would win. And of course, that makes you feel good, like, hey, I'm good at something. And then in high school, I took art lessons as well. My parents put me in some art lessons and then in high school I joined some art clubs and I was involved in that community.

And then when I hit college, my dad said, Hey, why don't you major in graphic design? Because computers are really big now and I don't want you to be a starving artist. And you know, you can draw, but on the computer. And so, I was like, okay, so I did that. And to this day, I still love art, obviously.

I have a whole room at home, my little studio that I'll paint in or craft or do something with my hands. I love to crochet.  It still makes me feel like I'm good at something and I'm not being judged or being, you know when I'm upset or I just need time to myself that I can just go into that world and everything else just disappears and I'm happy. And, you know, I'm at peace.

Art has really helped me overcome some of the anxieties of life, of being a cancer survivor, having to go through treatment and just the craziness that life can give you. So, it's something that I will probably always go to.

Joel

So you did school, did graphic design. Once you're out of school, what did you pursue in life after that?

Adrienne

I wanted to be a mom, so I got married and had two kids. They're now 17 and 13, so I have a senior in high school.

Joel

We’re a year behind you. I'm anxious for that time. I'm so proud. But so anxious.

Adrienne

I know, I know. And I don't feel old enough for this. But I guess I am. But yeah, they’re perfectly healthy and happy and great kids. And I also knew that I wanted to work at St. Jude or ALSAC, so I applied and finally got a job at ALSAC. Doing what I love, graphic design. So that way I can somehow in my small little way, give back to St. Jude and all the doctors and researchers and nurses and staff that helped me. Telling my story will hopefully give hope to other parents, you know, that all is not lost. Especially 40 years later when technologies and medicines are even better than they were then. So, you know, whatever I can do to give back is my goal.

Joel

I'm fascinated by something, too, as you talk through it, I think we share a lot of the same perspective about seeing how strong our parents were for us, about being like, Well, this is just something I go through. And for me, something too is, being a parent now as well, that's flipped for me is, I got a lot of cool milestones because of St. Jude.

But what I'm witnessing now is seeing my kids hit these milestones and like the gratitude I have that I'm able to see this. Do you feel that? How do you feel when you're seeing these your kids hit these big milestones in their life?

Adrienne

Yeah, it's amazing. Just watching them hit like, you know, my daughter's a senior in high school and I'm like, first off, I was a senior just a minute ago, but it's bringing me back to my time as a senior. And I'm watching her just enjoy it as much as I did. And I don't want her to take it for granted, you know, because I tried not to take it for granted either.

But life can change so quickly. And you never know what you're going to wake up to. But seeing my kids and my son, you know, having fun, just hanging out with a friend or, you know, I mean, his voice is changing now. So, like seeing, that's a milestone and seeing all that happen, it makes my heart happy.

And to know that St. Jude gave me that opportunity to have them, you know, I mean, they would not exist without me obviously, but just watching them makes me happy and seeing that that's almost a product of St. Jude. Like they're the ones that are making those memories happen for them and me and my husband and so many other family members. So life would be very different.

Joel

Yes, for sure. And something kind of touched on as well. I mean, you know, now treatment was 40 years ago for you. How does it make you feel to see, you know, like you talked about the medicine's improving, survival rates improving, and know that you're playing, you know, a small part in that through graphic design even.

Adrienne

Yeah. Well, and also we're part of the St. Jude Life study. I am more than happy to give as much blood and research and studies that I can do to help St. Jude improve those medicines. I look back and think about some of the things that I hear now that the kids go through that are different than what I went through.

I'm just so grateful for it and to know that I may have had a little bit of a part of that is amazing and makes me just want to go back again and again and again to whatever St. Jude needs from me. However I can help make those medications better and those treatments better where, you know, kids that are going through the same thing I went through are not struggling in school. Or, you know, to make a parent a little bit less anxious, you know, whatever I can do to help that effort, sign me up.

Joel

I feel the same way. And just so for the listeners context as well, our St. Jude Life program, it's really the first of its kind. It's a long term follow up study where they're really looking at us patients who were treated in the ‘70s like Adrienne, patients treated in the ‘80s like me, you know, kids who are being treated now, see how we're doing compared to normal population. And like she talked about making things better for this next generation.

Another cool thing you're getting to do is you're working with another former patient, kind of helping encourage some of our current patients to do artwork. What does that mean to you and what are you seeing from these kids through their artwork?

Adrienne

Children often can't communicate through words. I know I couldn't. They're different in the way that they communicate. So, one way that they can communicate is through art. Art comes in many different forms, but it can be very therapeutic, like it was for me. But I love watching them paint or color or something. And it just takes their mind off of whatever's ailing them that day. Or maybe they don't feel great, or maybe they're in a great mood, you know? And I love watching what they can create.

And that to me is a narrative for how they are feeling that particular moment. And we will use their patient art to help tell their stories, and use them in different ways where we can animate their art or turn their art into a T-shirt or make their art the background for a landing page, a website page or something.

And they're so proud of it when they see their art, it’s so amazing. They love seeing their art and it's something that they did, and it tells their story and that small little way of how they felt that particular day. I love that. It's a great healing vehicle for sure.

Joel

That's so cool. I love that. And just for you personally, what you know, got big milestones come up for those kids. Working and doing a beautiful job. What has St. Jude meant to everything that you have in your life, right now?

Adrienne

Oh, it means. It means everything. I mean, it means that when my kids finally grow up, I, you know, God willing, I'm still in good health. But I can go travel. I can do the things that anyone would want to do as they’re, you know, as they age. But be able to enjoy the life, the second chance that St. Jude gave me.

I recently got a tattoo of my St. Jude patient number on my arm. And so, you know, meeting another patient, a former patient, that's like the first thing we say to each other is like, Hey, I'm a patient too, Oh, wow, what's your number? And you're like, you know, it's four digits long or it's five digits long.

Joel

We started ordering our patients when they started coming to hospital in 1962, starting with number one. And now we're up, way up there now.

Adrienne

Yeah. Mine's in the 6,000s.

Joel

Mine’s in the 10,000’s. Yeah. A little behind you there.

Adrienne

Yeah. But yeah, that's how we kind of identify when you were here at St. Jude. But yeah, my kids, they got a kick out of that, out of me getting a tattoo of it. And they're like, Did it hurt? Did It hurt? I was like, Not at all. I'm kind of used to needles, you know? So, I've had a lot, a lot of needles in my life, and this was pretty tame.

So, but yeah, that was, that was kind of fun. They were proud of that. But it's amazing watching them grow up to be, you know, their independent little selves and to know that I had a part in that. And you know, they're going to be fine. They're going to be fine. And, you know, just hope and pray that, you know, they will be, you know, make good contributions to society and carry on the love of St. Jude because their mom was a part of St. Jude story. So I know that they will always be a part of St. Jude and carry on that love.

Joel

Well, I have no doubt they will be an amazing grown up, just like their mom is an amazing grownup. So Adrienne, thank you so much for taking time, for sharing your amazing journey with us today. We so appreciate it.

Adrienne

Well, thank you. It's been fun. Thank you, Joel.

Joel

Like many St. Jude patients, Adrienne has been able to live a full life. She's grown up and raised kids of her own after she had cancer at such a young age. It's just one example of how St. Jude changes generations of families. When Adrienne was a patient, the hospital hadn't even been open for 20 years. Now it's more than 60 years old.

Just think of all the generations of families that have been kept whole, that have grown, and that's all because of the donors who have sustained this mission over six decades. You can give to St. Jude online at stjude.org or click the link in the episode description.

This podcast is a production of ALSAC, the fundraising and awareness organization for St. Jude Children's Research Hospital. It's recorded by Andres Garcia and Nathan Black. It's produced by Geoffrey Redick. It's edited by Grace Korzekwa Evans. The music production is by Kazimir Boyle, and Louis Graham is the executive producer. I'm Joel Alsup. Thanks for listening and join us next time.

api.spreaker.com/v2/episodes/53217062/download.mp3